OT House buying

[Welches]

We're thinking of buying a house that's on the market under repossession.
We'd like to get a bigger house, but basically we can't afford one in this
area. So this seems to give us a reasonable option.
It's in a dreadful state. It's easy to work out-everything needs to be
replaced from carpet to parts of the ceiling plaster!!!
BUT it gives us potentially a much better house than we could otherwise
afford, and there's space to extend to give us a 4 bed house in the long
term.
What we'd like to do is extend to a 4th bedroom and extend the kitchen. We
could just about afford to do that as it's cheap. Then in later years (if we
have more money) there would be more improvements possible.
One of our problems is that we can't afford to have 2 morgages for a time,
but the house is not inhabitable (think wires sticking out of walls)
particularly with small children. We don't know whether we'd be able to get
work done before the final moving date.

Has anyone done this and has words of wisdom to give to us? We've very
inexperienced both in buying/selling houses and in home improvements.

We're reckoning approximately £20K to get it into a livable state and about
£25K for extension.

Thanks:
Debbie

[mogga]

On Tue, 04 Mar 2008 11:03:14 GMT, "Welches"

Post by Welches
We're thinking of buying a house that's on the market under repossession.
We'd like to get a bigger house, but basically we can't afford one in this
area. So this seems to give us a reasonable option.
It's in a dreadful state. It's easy to work out-everything needs to be
replaced from carpet to parts of the ceiling plaster!!!
BUT it gives us potentially a much better house than we could otherwise
afford, and there's space to extend to give us a 4 bed house in the long
term.
What we'd like to do is extend to a 4th bedroom and extend the kitchen. We
could just about afford to do that as it's cheap. Then in later years (if we
have more money) there would be more improvements possible.
One of our problems is that we can't afford to have 2 morgages for a time,
but the house is not inhabitable (think wires sticking out of walls)
particularly with small children. We don't know whether we'd be able to get
work done before the final moving date.

You have to sell your house before you buy the new one?
Is your house on the market?

Post by Welches
Has anyone done this and has words of wisdom to give to us? We've very
inexperienced both in buying/selling houses and in home improvements.
We're reckoning approximately £20K to get it into a livable state and about
£25K for extension.
Debbie

20k? How does that break down?
how long will the work take? Add on extra time and then see if you can
afford to hire a caravan and live in the garden.

[Welches]

Post by mogga
On Tue, 04 Mar 2008 11:03:14 GMT, "Welches"

Post by Welches
We're thinking of buying a house that's on the market under repossession.
We'd like to get a bigger house, but basically we can't afford one in this
area. So this seems to give us a reasonable option.
It's in a dreadful state. It's easy to work out-everything needs to be
replaced from carpet to parts of the ceiling plaster!!!
BUT it gives us potentially a much better house than we could otherwise
afford, and there's space to extend to give us a 4 bed house in the long
term.
What we'd like to do is extend to a 4th bedroom and extend the kitchen. We
could just about afford to do that as it's cheap. Then in later years (if we
have more money) there would be more improvements possible.
One of our problems is that we can't afford to have 2 morgages for a time,
but the house is not inhabitable (think wires sticking out of walls)
particularly with small children. We don't know whether we'd be able to get
work done before the final moving date.

You have to sell your house before you buy the new one?
Is your house on the market?

Yes, and we have a low offer, which we may/may not accept.

Post by mogga

Post by Welches
Has anyone done this and has words of wisdom to give to us? We've very
inexperienced both in buying/selling houses and in home improvements.
We're reckoning approximately £20K to get it into a livable state and about
£25K for extension.
Debbie

20k? How does that break down?

Oh it's broken up when we were reckoning. We also consulted with someone who
does renovating houses for a living and he reckoned (after we'd done our
figures so it didn't influence us) that £20K was about the figure he'd have
put on for a house of that size.
I can't remember, but it's like £2K for house rewireing (may not need but
need to take into consideration)
£2K for carpeting,
£4K new boiler (again may not need)
£1K for redecoration
I can't remember exactly.

Post by mogga
how long will the work take? Add on extra time and then see if you can
afford to hire a caravan and live in the garden.
--

A possibility. I've a feeling we need local permission to live in a caravan
on site, but I could be wrong.

It's probably off now as the other agent (the one we weren't dealing with)
have had an offer.

Debbie

[Eric Baber]

Post by Welches

Post by mogga
20k? How does that break down?

Oh it's broken up when we were reckoning. We also consulted with someone
who does renovating houses for a living and he reckoned (after we'd done
our figures so it didn't influence us) that £20K was about the figure he'd
have put on for a house of that size.

It sounds like it's currently a three-bedroom house, right? If so, 20k for
all the work you describe is *very* optimistic unless you'll be doing the
work yourself, in which case it's fairly realistic. If it really is
unliveable you're likely to be looking at £30k+, especially if the kitchen
and bathroom need replacing.

If on the other hand it's all cosmetic and no real heavy-duty building work
needs doing (e.g. no kitchen or bathroom, no new flooring, no tiling etc)
then £20k is reasonable. Though I wouldn't call that unliveable in that
case.

Regarding dual mortgage that really is a tricky one. We were in the same
situation and in the end we had an overlap period of about four weeks. As a
result we did much of the work on the new place ourselves to save money but
it's nerve-wracking. I don't really have any suggestions other than the
obvious but difficult ones such as move in with some (very good!!) friends
for a month or so, or with family. Or a caravan I suppose as someone
suggested.

Eric

[Welches]

Post by Eric Baber

Post by Welches

Post by mogga
20k? How does that break down?

Oh it's broken up when we were reckoning. We also consulted with someone
who does renovating houses for a living and he reckoned (after we'd done
our figures so it didn't influence us) that £20K was about the figure
he'd have put on for a house of that size.

It sounds like it's currently a three-bedroom house, right? If so, 20k for
all the work you describe is *very* optimistic unless you'll be doing the
work yourself, in which case it's fairly realistic. If it really is
unliveable you're likely to be looking at £30k+, especially if the kitchen
and bathroom need replacing.

Basically, the building appears sound.A bit of plastering (small amount) and
new electrics is probably all it needs before decoration, we've put in the
budget for a new boiler but it probably works in which case we'd keep it for
the time being. Kitchen needs appliances (if we don't take what we've got)
but we wouldn't redo it as we'd hope to extend it before. Bath needs new
taps but otherwise seems sound.
Whatr sort of hidden costs are we reckoning on?

Post by Eric Baber
If on the other hand it's all cosmetic and no real heavy-duty building
work needs doing (e.g. no kitchen or bathroom, no new flooring, no tiling
etc) then £20k is reasonable. Though I wouldn't call that unliveable in
that case.

It's not strictly unlivable, perhaps more that there's a certain amount that
would be much easier (like carpet replacement) done before moving in. It's
unlivable in the electrics mostly. There's trailing wires out of where
sockets should be and with a crawling 9 month old who loves wires (mostly in
mouth) that's not livable in (and a 4 year old who can't resist
touching/fiddling) Me and dh could live in, and probably #1, but #2 and #3
would be a different matter.

Post by Eric Baber
Regarding dual mortgage that really is a tricky one. We were in the same
situation and in the end we had an overlap period of about four weeks. As
a result we did much of the work on the new place ourselves to save money
but it's nerve-wracking. I don't really have any suggestions other than
the obvious but difficult ones such as move in with some (very good!!)
friends for a month or so, or with family. Or a caravan I suppose as
someone suggested.

Ideally I'd take the children out of the way for that time to family, but
there's schooling and family isn't local. I couldn't ask friends. I'd like
to stay friends!! :-) If someone offered it might be diffferent, but ther's
no way I could put someone under the stress of asking them.
Debbie

[Eric Baber]

Post by Welches
Basically, the building appears sound.A bit of plastering (small amount)
and new electrics is probably all it needs before decoration, we've put in
the budget for a new boiler but it probably works in which case we'd keep
it for the time being. Kitchen needs appliances (if we don't take what
we've got) but we wouldn't redo it as we'd hope to extend it before. Bath
needs new taps but otherwise seems sound.

Sounds like £20k would be reasonable in that case, in fact more than enough.
Also, where's the boiler? In the kitchen? If so, and if it still works, as
you say it'd be best to live with it until you do the extension, and replace
it then. Depending on how things are plumbed in and what type of boiler
you're replacing, replacing it could either be a very straightforward job,
or involve other work which in turn involves laying new pipes etc etc. I'd
replace the boiler only if necessary, and if possible when the whole kitchen
is being redone anyway so that if any wall needs un-plastering it can be
re-plastered while the whole kitchen is being done anyway.

Post by Welches
Whatr sort of hidden costs are we reckoning on?

Damp walls - damp might not be visible until you take off some of the
existing plastering (to do rewiring, for example). Have you had a full
survey done? Given the state of the house I think that might be a worthwhile
investment - that should pick up on any damp.

Damp/wet under the ground-floor floorboards - we picked up on that one,
fortunately before completion. The airbricks were overgrown so there wasn't
any draft under the floorboards, causing water to settle and damp-rot to set
in in the underground joists and floorboards. The result was a brand-new
downstairs floor, basically.

There are probably loads more but we don't want to put you off entirely :-))

Post by Welches
It's not strictly unlivable, perhaps more that there's a certain amount
that would be much easier (like carpet replacement) done before moving in.
It's unlivable in the electrics mostly. There's trailing wires out of
where sockets should be

That in itself doesn't mean rewiring is necessary - that might just mean you
need to screw in some sockets. That would be a dead-easy and cheap thing to
do - a couple of quid per socket and 5 minutes to screw each one in. If
you're not handy with that sort of thing it should take an electrician a
couple of hours to do, no more than that. Again that should be something a
full survey should pick up on - is entire rewiring necessary or just new
sockets.

Post by Welches
Ideally I'd take the children out of the way for that time to family, but
there's schooling and family isn't local. I couldn't ask friends. I'd like
to stay friends!! :-)

Too right :-)

Eric

[Welches]

Post by Eric Baber

Post by Welches
Basically, the building appears sound.A bit of plastering (small amount)
and new electrics is probably all it needs before decoration, we've put
in the budget for a new boiler but it probably works in which case we'd
keep it for the time being. Kitchen needs appliances (if we don't take
what we've got) but we wouldn't redo it as we'd hope to extend it before.
Bath needs new taps but otherwise seems sound.

Sounds like £20k would be reasonable in that case, in fact more than
enough. Also, where's the boiler? In the kitchen? If so, and if it still
works, as you say it'd be best to live with it until you do the extension,
and replace it then. Depending on how things are plumbed in and what type
of boiler you're replacing, replacing it could either be a very
straightforward job, or involve other work which in turn involves laying
new pipes etc etc. I'd replace the boiler only if necessary, and if
possible when the whole kitchen is being redone anyway so that if any wall
needs un-plastering it can be re-plastered while the whole kitchen is
being done anyway.

Boiler's in a cupbaord on the 1st floor next to the airing cupboard, I
think. If it works and is safe, then we'll live with it for a while. If we
extend over the garage then we may well want the cupboard area to make as
the access to the new room, so we'd put a new boiler in then. If we do have
to replace the boiler we'll probably go for one that goes in the loft, so we
have that option.
As we don't know whether it's working, we're budgeting on it not working so
we don't run out of money :-)

Post by Eric Baber

Post by Welches
Whatr sort of hidden costs are we reckoning on?

Damp walls - damp might not be visible until you take off some of the
existing plastering (to do rewiring, for example). Have you had a full
survey done? Given the state of the house I think that might be a
worthwhile investment - that should pick up on any damp.

We will go for a full survey. I don't think it would be damp. It's 1970s
construction. The front room smelt of damp dog :-) but the other rooms (and
it's been locked up some time with litle air) smelt fine. And it's something
I'm quite sensitive to.
If the survery picks up major structural stuff then we'll withdraw I think.
(unless sthey take a vastly lower offer which I don't think they will)

Post by Eric Baber
Damp/wet under the ground-floor floorboards - we picked up on that one,
fortunately before completion. The airbricks were overgrown so there
wasn't any draft under the floorboards, causing water to settle and
damp-rot to set in in the underground joists and floorboards. The result
was a brand-new downstairs floor, basically.

Ouch. That's something I hadn't thought about. The airbricks are free I
think. Maybe I'll go and have a nosy this afternoon. I'd like to meet the
neighbours and see how they'd feel about an extention over the garage, but
no one seems to know them :-)
It's a bit awkward as the garage is attached to their house for about 1' at
the front, and their house is set further forward, so going over the garage
would be next to their garden. But we have the other side if necessary,
which would be extending towards the road.

Post by Eric Baber
There are probably loads more but we don't want to put you off entirely :-))

:-)

Post by Eric Baber

Post by Welches
It's not strictly unlivable, perhaps more that there's a certain amount
that would be much easier (like carpet replacement) done before moving
in. It's unlivable in the electrics mostly. There's trailing wires out of
where sockets should be

That in itself doesn't mean rewiring is necessary - that might just mean
you need to screw in some sockets. That would be a dead-easy and cheap
thing to do - a couple of quid per socket and 5 minutes to screw each one
in. If you're not handy with that sort of thing it should take an
electrician a couple of hours to do, no more than that. Again that should
be something a full survey should pick up on - is entire rewiring
necessary or just new sockets.

Yes, again, we don't think it will need full rewiring, but we're budgeting
for the worst. I think the people coming out (it's repossession) were a bit
miffed and they've done some silly things like swing from lampfittings. We
felt really sorry for them and felt it was mean to capitalize on their loss
until we saw the place, and ralised that they'd done some deliberate damage
like that, and they've pulled some of the inside doors off the hinges and
scribbled on the walls.
I think it'll be a case of putting new sockets, lightswitches, and
lightfittings, but we're bugeting for more.

Post by Eric Baber

Post by Welches
Ideally I'd take the children out of the way for that time to family, but
there's schooling and family isn't local. I couldn't ask friends. I'd
like to stay friends!! :-)

Too right :-)

I'm thinking about stuff in storage (or the family room as it's the best
room) and us living in a caravan on the drive for a month. The children
would find that exciting, even if it'll drive me crazy!!!!

Thanks for your help:
Debbie
Ps. I've just put an offer in. I'm shaking all over. Not often I spend
quarter of a millon pounds in a morning....

[Chris French]

Post by Welches

Post by Welches

Post by mogga
20k? How does that break down?

Oh it's broken up when we were reckoning. We also consulted with someone
who does renovating houses for a living and he reckoned (after we'd done
our figures so it didn't influence us) that £20K was about the figure
he'd have put on for a house of that size.

It's not strictly unlivable, perhaps more that there's a certain amount that
would be much easier (like carpet replacement) done before moving in. It's
unlivable in the electrics mostly. There's trailing wires out of where
sockets should be and with a crawling 9 month old who loves wires (mostly in
mouth) that's not livable in (and a 4 year old who can't resist
touching/fiddling) Me and dh could live in, and probably #1, but #2 and #3
would be a different matter.

But things like wires where things have been removed can easily be
sorted so as to make them safe - an hour or so with a few spare sockets
or just blanking plates etc. to make things safe.

Yeah things are easier if their aren't kids around but if it's the case
of a good deal and not happening, you just put up with it. We redid most
of our house whilst we had young children in it - (re-palastering rooms,
rewiring the house, major redecorations too nearly all rooms etc. no
carpets in the hall way/stairs /landing for much of DD1's life there.)

[Dave {Reply Address in.Sig}]

Post by Welches
£4K new boiler (again may not need)

Seems a bit high to me, if all they're doing is taking out the old one and
putting a new one in the same place with minimal new pipework. I don't
remember exactly how much, but ours was a lot less than that a couple of
years ago.